Laugh Tor
Laugh Tor 09072mwhat can be done to control cost of renting not only apartments, but also commercial space, for e g bars???a bar owner in oslo center says his great expense is rent. there is one greatest landlord in oslo, his name is Thun(sp?). Is this still the middle ages??? Why is the punishment for killing folks by car so little in Norway??? (same in Sweden) Consider the alienation between the city people aND THE COUNTRY PEOPLE IN NORWAY --- central factor of Norwegian folly. 3/10/2m I hear it is common for children of farmers to get careers in the city, and then when the time comes, return to the farm as when pappa will hand it over, dropping career and depriving city of skill (n b, lack of commitment throughout career). The truckdrivers altho having the same rights of demonstrating as you or I, must not be permitted to use their vehicles as weapons --- the law must be clear: ergo, the roads must be the property of the state, and use of vehicles a licensed privilege; this privilege means every driver is subject to rules, and the notion “freedom of the road” is a fallacy. Accordingly use of seat-belts can be commanded. Also, use of trucks to carry oil or whatever constitutes a binding contract with the state for that specific purpose and no other. Use of trucks as recently to block roads etc should be a crime with drivers being replaced by military and confiscation of vehicles. And a reason France is so indulgent in such situations is that government there from day to day is quite authoritarian, and wants to avoid the insight that such strikes are tantrums in a context of citizen abuse generally, accordingly government denies the strikers´ unreasonableness, and pretends the strikers are given due consideration, and hopes folks will be fooled into believing the government is “democratic”. But oil tax should be per barrel, and NOT per dollar!!! The reasons are too obvious to list. Here in Norway there is now talk of raising the maximum sentence for murder from nine years to ten years --- but in my opinion thirty years even would be far too little!!!!!! And imprisonment for nasty crimes should be solitary and hard labor. First punish, then give therapy --- punishment is the most necessary part of therapy. And when the court agrees that the bad guy was made so by bad mommy, she (etc) should be punished.
The notion “All men (people) are created equal” refers solely to political status. Jefferson emphasized a “natural aristocracy”. The Declaration of Independence refered to the relative POLITICAL status of the colonists in America vis a vis the people AND ARISTOCRACY of England. But of course rabble exploited the phrase (“...equal”). Indeed, Henry James (inter alia) discussed the prevalent presumption which demanded that none allow the impression of superiority. This is one of America`s dilemmas --- but paradoxically an antidote to hermetic social blindness ubiquitous in pretentious societies like Britain, and aids the American frankness of thought, which posits sine qua non that truth is universally uncoded, a secular phase of Luther. 3jun2001 hello: In Oslo, Norway, the police are functionally apathetic. This cannot but eventuate in vigilante-ism. Much could be done to cut down on thefts of cars and bicycles and burglaries and other forms of violence---but little is actually done; tokenism merely. Someone, and several, must be held responsible for the apathy, and the public apathy must be confronted in a moral sense; ie, social morality. In Norway, two factors among others are particularly interesting: the Norwegian people are part country, part city; also, they are to a large degree (in the towns and cities) free of religious crap, but at the same time largely without moral clarity (discussed below) . In the meantime, a miasma of political correctness, unfounded on serious principles, but rather on popularistic consensus of yes-men, allows by its very vagueness, escape from real commitment to serious progress in important areas. But I do emphasize that it could be worse: Norway´s problem is non-disappoinment of lowered expectations (legitimized smugness). Of course Norway is one of the best places to reside; but what does not advance, collapses---and one weeps at potential lost. Why not the best? But the usual rot has much room in Norway, as who dares to complain fundamentally? Here we have magic legitimation (actually not valid, but instead, cheat- pulling of the wool over people´s eyes) by the pretense of Norway as an international moral leader, and a leader in the world of athletics etc. So why rock the boat? Ironically, foreigners living here, and enlightened immigrants, often feel like Marie Antoinette (the foreigner who just doesn´t get it, and so gets into trouble) . Our native friends and relatives smirk at our lack of savvy. And then there is the language problem. Too bad folks all round the world cannot read Norwegian and follow the disgusting news here. But also , it is difficult for immigrants to get nuances in the language and culture, so time goes by, and then apathy sets in. Unless, of course, it is a matter of direct ethnic confrontation, as between theAsian/African immigrants and the natives, about eg religious education in primary schools. ( & cf my page called “Territory Therapy”) 22jun01 17:15 About a year ago, Norway made a law against handheld mobil-fone use while driving; it seems often flouted with impunity. Easy to write car numbers of bad folks to report them; let´s do that.
280601 1906 I believe it is undemocratic to deprive some people of certain TV channels due to having to subscribe on cable. Consider that eg Animal Planet TV educates folks for conservation, and maybe if the hicks (and I use the pejorative intentionally) had that channel they would not massacre wolves. And in some homes people, especially children, are limitted to a few channels, which are not likely to be educational; whereas others have special channels which make them more educated and enlightened. Also, TV allows political information not otherwise available; whether discussions or simply being able to actually see the faces of politicians etc. Here in Norway there is another factor: parts of this sprawling country are near Sweden, parts not near any neighboring country, and parts near Denmark: the result is incidental availability of this or that other country´s transmissions, with great imbalance, which I believe tends to disunite the nation culturally. (but we oughtn´t subsidize power-mad channels, e g Fox (doubtless named for animal with red neck)(unless to study them as diseases)( added, fredag 19. oktober 2001 23:20)
250701 16:38 How come if a train driver crashes, he can be criminally guilty, but executives and engineers get away with murder? eg, designing unsafe cars, or buying unsafe tramcars (triks), or designing bad roads or buildings or bridges. And if a change is made to specifications for building, don´t they have to be approved anew specifically etc? Did they find out who made the bad weld in the Kjelland oil rig? etc. (& cf my page called “Evil”)
150801 22;56 One of the terrible problems is big trucks on the road. Today Germany announced that as of 2003 there will be added tolls for the big rigs; so a Norwegian truck spokesman reminds us that this is going to result in higher prices to consumers---the usual crap from unprincipled money-grubbing murderous transportation types: in fact, trucks have to be severely controlled, whatever the price: they should be kept off roads used by cars. (Learn from the company that puts its fish-loaded trucks on trains to get from Alesund )(added, fredag 19. oktober 2001 23:23
280801 2227 This is off the cuff, and i remind yáll of Robert Frost´s phrase: “I have a lover´s quarrel with the world”. And Lewis Mumford´s caveat, that with all his dire predictions, he hoped to be proven wrong. I myself rely on the reasonableness of my viewers (see, you have to be reasonable to understand that use of “viewers”), to take from me what may be helpful, and toss the rest --- I assume active participatory relationship.
I consider that in Norway there are several ethnicities of Norwegians, as will not surprise the natives, as they are known for considering denizens of the next valley, and with another dialect, to be foreigners (and some Norwegian valleys are so deep they cannot receive tv!) --- you have doubtless caught on to my style of exaggeration --- and I just looked in the Merriam to learn why two “g”s in exaggeration, and it is because the word is based on the word “agger” (to heap). But what interests me particularly is the conflict/relationship between country mouse and city mouse. And on top of that, the usual complex interweave of personality making up the national intellect: I know that much Norwegian mind-product is (and has long been) excellent by any standard --- but, as in any group anywhere, folly predominates; and in this isolated culture, shuddering between the ancient valley and the view from the peaks over the global brew of sophistication, an unfortunate smug self-righteousness pollutes awareness generally.
So I rely on the good humor of the patient people of Norway, as i slam the rampant stupidity I find unbecoming in so many of them, especially as it is (in my view) a matter of bad character --- i e, the general tendency to block awareness. This shameful characteristic of this country should be cleaned up, so upcoming generations may stand tall among the cognoscenti as well as among the athletic.
Jumping at last into medias -res (as recommended by one of my favorite professors, Jean-Pierre Barricelli), I offer you the case of the lost police captain: altho I emphasize that it is not that he is himself lost, but rather that others have misplaced him.
One of the reasons Norway escapes scrutiny international, is the ubiquitous problem of native languages---and I mention that the officer i refer to has the title “lensmann”, and i am too lazy to look it up, so i will call him captain. Anyway, he recently was moved by a couple of particularly gruesome crimes, to recommend that women should be more circumspect in their choice of mate (i e, with a view to escaping getting killed, etc). ( Aha, i see in a sub-title on tv, that lensman gets translated as “sheriff” --- but subtitling here is unreliable, anyway)(added, fredag 19. oktober 2001 23:29)
Now, I avidly recommend that police methods and legal strategy and social policy must be reformed so as to provide effective protection and prevention --- this is a vexed problem globally, and even in such enlightened regions as Alabama, doubtless. “To serve and to protect” unfortunately is as vague a slogan as “For the best of the child”. We live (or not) in an era before the clarification of legal philosophy as to prevention of crime. Police like to say “We can´t do anything until a crime has been committed”.
So, while I would like to offer some practical suggestions as to law and practice, etc, the notion that women should exercise caution when dealing with potential mates, cannot be gainsaid. But see the furor in the national daily newspaper “Dagbladet”!!!!!
“It is unacceptable to have such opinions” says Ingunn Yssen (Director of the Equal Opportunity Center)(my translations).
As a shrewd canny perceiver of locked brainism in demagogues (and one can be a demagogue altho picayune), I file that with the vast catalogue of Vatican indexing throughout its foul anti-survival history --- or any similar category of such minds as Mao or Stalin or Hitler or Senator Joseph McCarthy.
I do, however mention, that Lensmann Harald Andersen (for that is his name)(I love the web characteristic that I can get away with archaic style) did controversially suggest that women contemplating setting up home with a Mohammedan should first read the Koran, to be cued in to what can be expected from a representative of that sexist culture --- and I myself suggest that on the other hand a woman contemplating hitching up with a Norwegian of the non-Mohammedan sort, ought to first study Snorre (the standard and basic collection of sagas of the Scandinavian kings of yore). I have to assume that everyone is well aware that the basic old-line Norwegian male is not always a ray of sunshine. Note that the most recent gory crime was done by a Moslem, presumably deranged; rather like anyone fallen victim to the perverted notion of marriage commonly foisted upon the innocent young and the weak-minded of any and all or none religious denominations --- so indeed I do remind Mr Andersen that we use others as mirrors of ourselves, so as to deal indirectly with factors we prefer to deny as descriptive of our precious sanctimonious selves. But I feel that he would agree with me in that. His basic point is as true and as old as the dawn of time: not only have women throughout history (and pre-history) selected the wrong men, they have bred with them, such that now we are confronted with the simple unfortunate fact that a good man is hard to find.
Indeed, I wonder if society wants crime to occur, so bad people can be identified (that this attitude would be sick does not make it untrue) --- the atavistic lust to catch and punish and eliminate the bad; note that if we get a nice society wherein crime is eliminated, we may eventually suddenly get an explosion of massive evil because we lost sight of the immanent hidden latent bad. So maybe the best a woman can do is get a man to reveal himself as bad, so he can get stigmatized and ostracized --- sort of a social bull-fight. Unfortunately, the police also are people; and so are the legislators (not to mention the scholars and experts) --- as the character says in Sartre´s play, “No Exit”: “Hell is other people”.
A good beginning for society in this matter, would be candor: but that requires an awareness of what is real --- I suggest that the relationship that sets the stamp for serious bonding between women and men, is the relationship between the child and the ( both) genetic parents, and NOT the marriage- type partnership itself. People are brought up implanted with an obligation to make a marriage-type condition (regardless of ceremony or whatever) work, in the sense of prevail, in the sense of dominate the couple´s lives, in the sense of some obsessive obligation to everyone who helped one in childhood, in the sense of defining the monarchy of Prince Charming or Ali Baba or Confucius etc.
But here in Norway, certain thoughts are forbidden. And they are forbidden on the basis that they are not in the best interest of the childish populace --- the attitude that everyone is either a proto-commissar or a soft-headed object to be patronized secretly by benign liars who are committed to doing the best for the child of whatever age. Perhaps the Norwegians so resent the former hegemony by the Danes (and having a Danish King now) that they refuse to SEE the wisdom in the tale by H C Anderson, “The Emperor´s New Clothes”, and would, in a Norwegian version, suffocate the daring child immediately.
The trammels of the politically correct lines prevent honest thought, lest it crumble the kindergarten walls of smug pseudo-security expressed in the Norwegian slogan, “We have it so good here on the mountain”. Historically, the wonderful transition away from respect for the national church and its silly dogmas, has however left folks with the sermonesque pretentions of uneducated self-righteous missionaries of smug slogans in positions of power.
These quasi-commissars pollute the media with insults to the intelligence, as subtle as any castration in the nightmare reveries of Habermas. The gentle knife of the easy Norwegian National Missionary Church has been superceded by the gentle cooperation of state subsidy for docile and endocilating (my neologism) media lobotomy of the public mind.
We get what media we deserve. We are responsible.
Mr Andersen could not have intended to blame women for being victimized, per se; yet this is the reading imposed upon his words by the silly furorists (my neologism?) in “Dagbladet”. Society must give support to these victims, but it is logically absurd to attempt that, without stating the problem. We cannot “go forward together with our united strength” unless we identify the enemy --- and we cannot be united unless the victim separates herself (or indeed himself, for there are violent women, too) from the perpetrator; so when we get a report of a woman who endured FIFTEEN YEARS of violence before recently getting out, and are told in conclusion, “She has a higher education, and considers herself a strong girl “ (note: “sterk jente” --- “sterk”, meaning strong in character; but why the word “jente”, instead of “dame” (woman)?!)(after fifteen years in that relationship, how young can she be? (assuming this 15 is not a typical Norwegian misprint)(Norway, Land of Incompetence)), we must (assuming the correct number is 15 years in the violent relationship) ask if her strength of character came upon her recently, and possibly as a benign effect of the grand training she received from her violent mate, or if there is some other, perverse, reason why this “girl” of “strong” character did not leave within fifteen days.
But, you see that my complaint is against the media itself, as part of a conspiracy of self-righteousness. We see similar dishonesty in the discussion of whether Norway should continue to have a monarchy (instead of a republic), in the newspaper of the far-left, “Klasse-kampen”: of a two-page spread, most of one of the pages is dedicated to a large foto of a lady from India, and we get her opinion against kings, based on her admiration of the system in INDIA!!!!! This is obvious exploitation of the goody-two-shoes impulse to give newcomers prestige.
Of course, any media outlet uses dispute “ to sell papers”. They hope we will argue. And I am grateful to one and all for being grist for my mill. I hope that I have well and truly joined this dispute, and that some Norwegians who think will be shamed into taking off the wool from their eyes --- we who want improvement, want improvement instead of smugness. We need not fear thought. It is not a war between the sexes we who think want: we want its resolution after these many eons --- we are all seekers after a truth that will set us free: we cannot progress by scampering after points in an eternal soccer match.
Instead of Norwegians obsessed with not losing face, whether between the sexes, or internationally, in the Olympics of intellect, we need Norwegians who accept the advanced state of their society basically, and simply try to keep up the good work. Ah, yes, and the Norwegians who think, have an obligation to inspire their compatriots instead of coddling them as failed shepherds who kill wolves. Best Wishes
290801 0715 There is an ad on Tv for Stratos chocolate bar, in which a child shakes up a campagne bottle for fun --- but that is dangerous: isn´t anyone paying attention to this crap?!
070901 2120 In “Aftenposten” (national basic newspaper of Norway), 030901, psychologist Sissel Gran has column about the Harald Andersen bit very like mine, but more focused on the hitting problem itself. In her remarks she mentions that after hitting comes sex (often) --- I note this is very bad pattern, as it reinforces bad behavior, and makes a complex associating sex with hitting; arguing can increase libido, but when it gets physical definite rules must apply, prohibiting sex subsequent. Of course, certain apes use sex to mollify, but the latent pattern in humans is dangerous. But note also that either or both partners might need violence as prelude to sex, due to shame at sexual behavior --- the violence may distance the person from sense of submission in acts which were taught to be foul (e g, a man might require humiliation of the partner so he does not then feel too submissive when loving and abandoning self; or he may merely need to redress the balance, feeling need to participate although insecure in sharing, having been taught to take sex, and that sex is basically subversive vs his self-image as tough guy). Of course a woman may incorporate the violence as part of the sex scene, and willingly trade submission for sex. There are other causes, but this pattern of linking violence to sexual reward is dangerously cumulative, with what can have started initially as incidental, turning into a discovery hard to cancel (“Wow, look what happened. I liked it and she liked it”). Such contracts are unacceptable to the conscious mind and to the dialogue in the relationship, so cannot be discarded in themselves, and consequently get locked in place. I hasten to mention another aspects, lest you get the impression that this is the whole story: a mate may hit a mate due to a sense that the other lacks self-respect --- like a Marine who cannot tolerate a “weak sister” lest they all get killed in this world of danger. Anyway, the pattern mentioned by the psychologist in the article is alarming in itself, and for the reasons I named. Especially as after violence, especially a first instance, it is hard for many people to say no to the classic way people intimately “make up”.
070901 2253 Beyond or deeper than all issues of societal trouble is the squalor of our era in evolution, with so much to learn while we slowly evolve --- it will be centuries before we catch up, even with what could actually be accomplished now by some. We must keep in mind that people centuries or milennia in the future will look at us like we look at the monkeys; and it behooves us to ask in what ways.
Squalor is the tag for what most people live in in the current phase of evolution. It is folly to assume that living together is simple. The more we are sophisticated the better off we are, and freedom or liberty is relative and lives in knowledge: justice is a prize denied the ignorant; the state of nature is bestial.
So people must study how to do the simplest things together --- and the attempt is the very meat of relationships: we are mental animals, and evolve mentally and socially. We human beings are not like the creatures on “Animal Planet” TV --- we are from animals, but not of animals: we are human beings, they are not. It is pathetic to see “scientists” make analogies between human beings and animals of field, stream, veldt and jungle. Especially disgusting is the anthropomorphizing of them in the prejudice of British Empire mentalities, supposedly to make it easier for us all to understand --- of course we are expected (if, as is usually the case, we are weakminded) to absorb the mutual confirmation of validity, that animal behavior confirms bestial human conduct, while throw-back perversions in humans explain our common heritage with them.
If the elite (who have high native intelligence coupled with excellent education, etc) care to help ourselves and the less gifted too, in the difficult sphere of marital type (in the broadest understanding of the concept) relationships, we must insist on realistic training starting in early childhood, to inculcate attitudes and eventual sophistication in how to develop together as mates. This cannot be done on the cheap, and it cannot be done based on compromises with ancient deceptions. We must stop as much as possible, lying to one another through our institutions---but this will not happen in the foreseeable future: so it is devil take the hindmost, save yourself and flee the ubiquitous corruption. And precisely this is the foundation of most ethnicities: the attempt to establish tribal truths although surrounded by other-minded groups, or groups without minds at all.
What is the basis for mate relationships? Have you considered the reasonableness of your received wisdom? Do you have an idea as to WHY we have mate relationships? Or is it assumed that the wisdom of the gutter will combine with the lust of the wet-dream and the insanities of troglodyte churches, to produce a benign chemistry?
180901 2020 The reason Norway has a very high level of people staying home from work due to illness, because they have very bad incompetent ignorant psychologically unhealthy primitive inadequate nasty cruel sick management --- but what would you expect from wolf killers.
061001 2027 In Oslo folks go around affixing posters over other posters, thus inviting violence --- why not some regulation? cf Immediate Letters to Establishment
111001 1934 post office bits: A sign says the money is in a time-locked vault, but then I see 3 workers with their hands in the money (lots) right in front of me at a busy time. pretty dumb. 20:51 At other post office the previous day, I needed fotocopies but saw no machine so started to wait but it was busy, so I left --- on the way out I noticed a small sign in a corner saying copies were to be got across the street at a commercial copy place. Also, I had got notice of arrival of books, but without naming which post office (of two possible). The next day i went to other post office where i got copies and the books. But i am glad I had not stayed at the other one, because I was preparing myself to go to jail if they would not make copies. torsdag 25. oktober 2001 19:20 FLASH NORWAY NOW FORBIDS ANONYMOUS SEMEN DONATION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! EXCELLENT praise where deserved. onsdag 7. november 2001 03:22 I hear that norway is about to improve service for mental illness --- good luck. 03:23 I see on DW tv (German internatinal ) that the entire German legal system is collapsing.
lørdag 17. november 2001 04:20 As well as schools being dirty, so also are the public bath houses (Oslo). But there is talk of improving the service offered to the mentally ill. Better too little too late than never, wot? 22:50 here´s more from the newspapers: Great lack of security at Gardermoen (Norway international airport near Oslo). International security report held back by air travel authority. Getting Norwegian disability pension like lottery, dependant on which doctor´s attitude. Norwegian train tunnels are death traps, and this not taken seriously by authorities. 3/4 of patients in Norwegian mental hospitals had not previously got psychotherapy. søndag 18. november 2001 07:33 The key word to describe Norwegian mentality: SUPERFICIAL. 08:21 Norwegian candy add has child secretly shaking up champagne bottle to make it kick out cork when adult opens it --- don´t these people know (or care) that that is dangerous?!
laugh tor søndag 13. januar 2002 20:32 The lady with the recent book in USA something about the “new thought police”, about political correctness among the feminists, should examine the crummy situation here in Norway, with institutionalized opposition to personality, pulchritude and porn; and the morbid obsession with preventing tv from allowing individuality --- of course there is also a battle going on in this area, but Norway is neck and neck with Afghanistan: tv has always been considered a threat to the entrenched bucolic ignorance pervading the Norwegian mind. Even the ubiquitous efforts to copy USA are so lame as to nauseate --- a superficial veneer is all that is wanted, not a sea-change. Actually the key word to describe most of the Norwegian mind is “SUPERFICIAL”. The cause of this ailment is their rejection of female full-buttockedness. And in politics they vote for party list, not for individual candidates, lest celebrity be allowed. It is a conspiracy of mediocrity. And the disease on top of the pneumonia, the complication, is the subversion of the city by country-folks in city jobs without city mentalities, and just waiting to go home to the wolf-murdering sheep-farm.
--------------------------------------------to: “FBI” NRK Oslo tirsdag 25. desember 2001 20:57 re Bislet area re cars traffic etc:--- I wonder how to get something done --- drivers coming out of Bislet Circle in Oslo figure they have escaped a trap and zoom forward, ignoring the pedestrian crosswalks at Pilestredet (at the Rimi supermarket), especially, but also the two other exit streets (Josephinesgt and the one at the south-west side of the stadium). So, much better marking is needed!!!!! Also: at Wilhelmsgt at Sporveisgt, the traffic signal post on the south-east corner should add a light to confirm the signal for cars going east from Sporveisgt into Wilhelmsgt. By the way I predict that some nuts will drive into the inviting new wide spaces for pedestrians in the Bislet area. Some protection is needed. TV could plant video cameras all around Bislet, as the circle itself is still confusing to drivers and Charlie Chaplin would love it. Of course in setting up the new benches for sporvei customers at Bislet, it has still not been learned to orient them at an angle addressing the oncoming tramcars. Ah well. I also predict that by 2101 Oslo Sporvei will not charge or use tickets. And any attempt to make it attractive enough to sell to investers will have failed. Of course, by that time the Norwegian branch of BBC (called NRK) will get its money directly through taxation, like any other necessary service. study my website: www.themartianembassy.com email: marconi@themartianembassy.com or freud@themartianembassy.com Please broadcast original “Star Trek” and all Kurosawa and all Jean Gabin and all Lana Turner. Save the great apes, e g, the Bonobos. Wishing for the Best, Robert Chadis Louisesgt 4-C, 0168 Oslo --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- p s: fredag 4. januar 2002 23:46 I am truly amazed at the stupidity of the incompetent menaces who forgot about the taxi stand at Bislet Circle. Now (and the gray cab fone box is still there) cabs come right up on the sidewalk and when they leave they drive right off AT THE CROSSWALK. Won´t someone fix this intolerable situation before there is a major law-suit against Oslo Sporvei for gross negligence?! Chadis ((mailed snail mail 080102)) ------------------------------------------------------------- tirsdag 22. januar 2002 16:16 to “FBI” NRK, Oslo by snail mail Bjørnstjern Bjornstrands Pl 1 : re my recent letter re Bislet Circle: Now there is a temporary cab-stand on Louisesgt, but, altho the cab-fone is gone from the old Theresesgt location, there is no sign for the benefit of either customers or cabbies, saying the old stand is cancelled; some cabs still stop there. I consider this behavior typically Norwegian, and will mock it in my web-site section I call “Laugh Tor”. My site is: www.themartianembassy.com. e-mail; freud@themartianembassy.com wistfully, (Elf) Robert Chadis Louisesgt 4-C, 0168 Oslo
-------------------------------------onsdag 6. februar 2002 20:56 In Oslo prices vary drastically not only vs 7-11, but also local stores vs supermarkets (by local I do not mean local ) --- the corner miniunsupermarket charges 140% (almost half again as much) for raisins and dishwash (same brands). But even vs supermarkets (such as they are here in little Oslo) are some shocking differences, as same brand sardines can in one costs 11 krowns, and in another 14 (about 9 krowns to the U S dollar). There are other amazing differences. Maybe this ...yes, i will copy this (Helpful Hints bit) into my section Laugh Tor.
fredag 22. februar 2002 19:14 see amazing correction in Helpful Hints!